08.21.08
46 Million U.S. Workers Have No Paid Sick Days
But, according to Yahoo News, lawmakers in 12 states have proposed legislation in the past year that would require businesses to provide them.
This problem is yet another example of how many Americans (FORTY THREE PERCENT of the private industry workforce) lack basic economic human rights:
“Proposed federal legislation would provide workers with seven days of paid sick leave a year for employees who work 30 or more hours a week. The benefit would be prorated for part-time workers.
Sen. Barack Obama, the presumptive Democratic presidential nominee, supports the legislation.
Sen. John McCain, the presumptive Republican nominee, opposes employer mandates, particularly when the economy is slowing, his campaign said.”
It’s hard to imagine that there are people in the FOOD industry who do not have paid sick days, huh?
And because some people were asking: Yeah, Spiddlement will DEFINITELY be voting OBAMA.
Link (to “States push laws to require sick paid days” via Yahoo News)
US News said,
August 21, 2008 at 4:19 pm
I haven’t slept for ten days, because that would be too long.
waltzingaustralia said,
August 23, 2008 at 3:14 am
I’m just curious. Is this only talking about people who work for big companies? Or are they taking into account the fact that the majority of the U.S. workforce is either self-employed or works in a small family business? I’m self-employed, and I don’t get any paid sick days, but I don’t expect them. It’s part of the price I pay for independence. (Conversely, most of the time, if I’m sick, I can still slump over my keyboard and get at least a little work done. But it did hurt me financially when I broke my wrist last year.)
Statistics are such a tricky thing. I wonder what that 46 million is really saying. Especially since you mention food. In Chicago, the vast majority of restaurants are family-owned storefronts where mom cooks and the kids serve the customers. So even if the government offered paid sick days, they wouldn’t take them, because the restaurant would close. A paid sick day wouldn’t help them keep their business going.
I do think every major corporation offers sick days. So I’m wondering who it is that lawmakers are pushing for those sick days.
Just curious — as one who has no paid sick days (and has almost no friends who have paid sick days) and it was by choice.
escaperabbit said,
August 24, 2008 at 5:32 pm
Thanks for your comments… these are interesting questions that I don’t know the answer to.
I’m not sure whether every major U.S. corporation offers sick days…. Walmart, for example, is one of the nation’s largest employers, yet they don’t offer any sick days for part time workers and it may even be difficult to take sick days as a full time worker:
http://walmartwatch.com/blog/archives/wal_marts_sick_leave/
What is the situation like in Australia? They seem to have much better laws for workers than the U.S. Do workers employed by small businesses get paid sick days? Obviously, it would be hard for self employed people anywhere to get paid sick days, since they are paying their own salary, so that’s a good point.
waltzingaustralia said,
August 25, 2008 at 7:25 am
Looking at the number of lay-offs going on these days, it’s hard to justify forcing a company to cut employees so that the few remaining employees get slightly better benefits. But I probably just feel that way because I know so many people who were recently laid off for just that reason.
As for numbers of self-employed and small companies, I’ve done a little research. Some of the statistics are a few years old, but still relevant — especially because the number of self-employed is growing all the time (some estimate it has doubled since the 2000 census). In 2003, there were 12.2 million non-agricultural self-employed in the United States. Include the farmers, and that number jumps. In 2000, one out of every 10 immigrants was self-employed, and that number has grown steadily since then.
According to testimony before the Senate earlier this year, 70 percent of American businesses have 10 employees or fewer. And 96 percent have 100 or fewer. So most Americans are either self-employed or in tiny companies. Even if WalMart got forced to pay part-time employees sick days (and I can’t honestly say that I’ve ever known anyone working part time who expected sick leave), it still will only affect a very tiny fraction of that 46 million, if it helps anyone at all. The thing I’m afraid of is that they will put restrictions on all businesses, including small ma & pa operations, that will shut the small businesses down. (Government has never been good at discerning the differences between a giant corporation and a family-run business.) The biggest impact would likely just be more people out of work.
So it’s likely that a mandate to make companies pay sick days will have virtually no impact on those 46 million.
As for Australia, you’re dealing with a national population similar to that of the largest cities in the U.S. It’s really hard to make comparisons. They also get a lot more time off than Americans do– but they’re paid about half as much. It’s virtually impossible to have a system where you can get paid a whole lot and still have lots of time off, sick or otherwise.
escaperabbit said,
August 27, 2008 at 3:24 am
Thanks again for your comments and research — it’s fun to see actual discussion on here!
>So most Americans are either self-employed or in tiny companies.
I can see the dilemma for small businesses (and I can also see how defining a ’small business’ can be tricky), still I believe in basic economic human rights. If someone is truly self-employed, then they would obviously have no paid vacation. But for small companies, I dunno… don’t those people still get sick sometimes?
I have never worked for a small company without benefits, so I can’t imagine what it would be like. Sounds stressful though. Do those people just work when they’re sick? What if they are too sick to work? Do they just lose their jobs?
>The biggest impact would likely just be more people out of work.
That seems like an assumption. I hear similar arguments against raising minimum wage, yet I have seen research that raising the minimum wage doesn’t really cause lay-offs. Is there data to back this up?
Like, would giving five paid sick days per year *really* cause people to lose their jobs? That doesn’t seem like many days really.
>As for Australia, you’re dealing with a national population similar to that of >the largest cities in the U.S. It’s really hard to make comparisons.
Why is it hard to make comparisons because of size? I’m not necessarily disagreeing, just curious.
Considering Australia’s social policies are more similar to most industrialized countries in the world than the U.S.’s, I kind of think America is the oddball.
Living here in Japan, I have paid sick days, paid vacation, single-payer healthcare. I honestly think it would be a very difficult transition back to the “every man for himself” system in the U.S. where businesses are not very regulated with how they treat employees. There are some protections: minimum wage, mandatory overtime, etc. But even those didn’t exist at one time.
waltzingaustralia said,
August 27, 2008 at 11:15 am
Okay — before I continue the discussion of business — I’ll be in Tokyo in November. Aside from all the “must see” stuff (most of which I saw on my last trip), what is something most visitors don’t see that they should? I’ve been to Tsukiji, the Edo Museum, and all the usual spots, from traditional to Electric City. But what else? Just one or two places that you’ve discovered that most people don’ know about. Restaurants acceptable in this category.
Now, back to business. The government has categories of small business: one, under 10, under 100. Above that, you’re a big business. Most U.S. businesses are 10 people or fewer. My experience of these businesses is, in fact, the opposite of what you fear. They tend to be more like a family. The huge corporations for which I’ve worked, all of which had paid sick days, were usually high-pressure locations where you came in if you were anything short of dead. The small businesses, both those with whom I’ve worked and those I simply know because I am associated with them in some way (friends, or I use their services), are more likely to try to help someone if they’re sick, even if they can’t pay them. Small businesses usually act more like a family, and you don’t get rid of family because they’re sick. (And then there are businesses that really ARE family.) I know someone who works for a small company that closes when the Renaissance Faire comes to town, and all the employees go. Smaller businesses are usually nicer. Not always, of course, but usually.
It is in the world of giant corporations where you’re a nameless widget that can be removed without remorse. Of course, with a few exceptions, most of the really big corporations are no longer strictly American– i have worked for several that appear all-American, but the parent company is somewhere in Europe. Heck, even the American Oil Company is owned by British Petroleum. They make decisions by the numbers.
As for not having benefits being stressful — I guess it depends on what your life is like. If you’ve got three kids, a spouse with a degenerative disease, and a history of cancer, benefits probably seem necessary. Personally, I’m not much into Western medicine (except for broken bones — x-rays are great), but I’ve never encountered medical benefits that help you with vitamins or supplements, so I never got much out of medical benefits.
I actually believe some medical benefits are almost destructive, in that they do not encourage prevention. I can remember being denied payment once because something was preventive. I explained that it would prevent the need down the road for thousands of dollars in surgery. They said they would pay for the surgery, but not the “ounce of prevention” — because they couldn’t prove it really prevented anything.
I found it far more stressful to be in the corporate world than to work at home, even without benefits. (I do buy my own major medical disaster insurance, but that’s it.)
Also, most corporations consider your benefits to be about 30 percent of your compensation, so the amount they’re willing to pay you is 30 percent lower than if you didn’t have benefits. Since I took advantage of very few of the benefits (I don’t have children who need scholarships, and I’m not going back to college), I was definitely not getting 30 percent-worth for the loss of additional income. This is not hypothetical. In addition to knowing a lot of people in the field of benefits development, I once was working freelance for a large company, and when they offered me an in-house job, they started with, “Of course, your benefits represent about 30 percent of your compensation, so we’ll pay you 30 percent less than we do now.” So I actually make a lot more money not having benefits. (And there are organizations — social and business — through which one can get discounts and benefits, if one needs them. I take advantage of a number of these.) If companies don’t lay you off, they have to get the money some other way.
As for the people out of work — it’s not an assumption, but it is anecdotal. I know dozens of people who have been laid off right after their companies had to increase some benefit or pay for some group. It represents a lot of companies, however — and big ones — so it’s not just hypothetical. And while five paid sick days doesn’t seem like that much, multiply it by the 10,000 employees some of the biggest companies have, and it adds up — to a couple hundred salaries, in fact.
And yes — numbers was why it’s not easy to make comparisons between the U.S. and Australia. With only 20 million in Australia, we’re talking about an economy that’s roughly the size of greater metro New York. Everything is just a little less complicated when the numbers shrink.
I think it’s interesting that you mention social policies in industrialized countries. Asia is in pretty good shape, largely because there are social institutions that keep things polite, and poverty is recent enough in history to keep people ambitions. However, no one in the U.S. would tolerate the level of interference and invasion of privacy with which much of Asia is comfortable (for example, Singapore). As for Europe, most of their economies and societies are in disastrous shape. France, for example, has great benefits, but also has high unemployment, especially an issue among the young Muslims who are flooding in from North Africa — hence the burning of Paris last year. So I actually think being an oddball, at least compared to most of Europe, is not a bad thing.
escaperabbit said,
August 31, 2008 at 12:11 am
>Okay — before I continue the discussion of business — I’ll be in Tokyo in >November. Aside from all the “must see” stuff (most of which I saw on my >last trip), what is something most visitors don’t see that they should? I’ve
There’s just so many things here, so it’s a difficult question. Have you ever been to Tsukishima (Moon Island)? It’s near Tokyo and is famous for monjayaki. I think that’s a fun place to have dinner (and not so expensive).
I also like the Gyoza Museum located inside Sunshine City in Ikebukuro. If you like gyozas, you will be in heaven.
A nice day trip, not too far from Tokyo, is Kawagoe. It’s a nice walk with many old buildings, nice restaurants, traditional temples, and shops.
A really easy thing — but great — is to take the Yurikomome line from Shimbashi station over the Rainbow Bridge to Odaiba/Tokyo Bay. That’s a great ride if you’ve never done it.
One place I really love is the Yokohama area. I haven’t been able to get out there much myself lately. If you have time, Enoshima island is not that far from Tokyo. I would totally recommend going there for a beautiful walk, view of the water, food, and relaxing atmosphere. It’s one of my favorite places in Japan, without going to the countryside.
If you need any more suggestions, let me know. I am obviously a big fan of this place, so I wouldn’t mind helping you with anything to make your trip more fun.
>Small businesses usually act more like a family, and you don’t get rid of >family because they’re sick. (And then there are businesses that really ARE >family.) I know someone who works for a small company that closes when
Fair enough. I did not mean to characterize small businesses as caring less about their employees than big businesses, and I’m sorry if I did. However, I still believe in the right to paid sick days for workers.
>life is like. If you’ve got three kids, a spouse with a degenerative disease, >and a history of cancer, benefits probably seem necessary.
Of course, when you are healthy and have no family, it’s very easy to take a job without benefits. This is often the argument to justify jobs with no benefits (”The workers are just part time high school kids”). But, if small businesses employ as many people as you have said, I suspect that many workers do have kids and health issues, etc.
Plus, life circumstances can change quick. A sudden illness or the decision to start a family may happen, and then people at such jobs are in big trouble.
>Personally, I’m not much into Western medicine (except for broken bones >— x-rays are great), but I’ve never encountered medical benefits that help >you with vitamins or supplements, so I never got much out of medical >benefits.
I’m not really crazy about the term “Western medicine”. Before doing what I do now, I worked in alternative healthcare. I eventually came to the realization that there are only two kinds of medicine: evidence based medicine, and non evidence based medicine — it doesn’t really matter where it came from.
Obviously, prevention is an important part of healthcare. Thus, the need for check-ups and diagnosing problems early. One problem in the U.S. is people delaying going to the doctor until problems are severe, due to lack of health insurance or being under-insured.
>I actually believe some medical benefits are almost destructive, in that they >do not encourage prevention. I can remember being denied payment once >because something was preventive. I explained that it would prevent the >need down the road for thousands of dollars in surgery. They said they
It sounds like your problem was less with Western Medicine than with healthcare that failed to cover preventative treatments/under-insured. Again, this is a very common scenario for Americans who do not have adequate coverage and must wait until they can “go to the emergency room” with a major problem.
>As for the people out of work — it’s not an assumption, but it is anecdotal. >I know dozens of people who have been laid off right after their >companies had to increase some benefit or pay for some group. It
The research on this I heard was presented by economist Jared Bernstein, author of the book _Crunch: Why Do You Feel So Squeezed?_.
Most of the stuff I’ve heard about people being laid off because of slightly increased benefits is anecdotal.
>And yes — numbers was why it’s not easy to make comparisons between >the U.S. and Australia. With only 20 million in Australia, we’re talking about >an economy that’s roughly the size of greater metro New York. Everything >is just a little less complicated when the numbers shrink.
OK, but I still don’t completely understand this. It’s amazing to me that every other industrialized country in the world can offer healthcare, paid sick days, even education to their people. But the U.S., the world’s richest country, cannot. I think it’s quite shameful.
>countries. Asia is in pretty good shape, largely because there are social >institutions that keep things polite, and poverty is recent enough in history >to keep people ambitions. However, no one in the U.S. would tolerate the
I think Americans are the most ambitious people in the world. They certainly work longer hours than any other country. So I’m not sure what being ambitious has to do with it.
This may just come down to a difference in worldview. I do not consider economic rights to be a special privilege or a luxury… I consider them human rights. From my viewpoint, it’s like saying someone does not have a right to police or fire protection or the post office because of where they work. These things are just part of what you need to keep a society functioning and insure life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.
waltzingaustralia said,
August 31, 2008 at 6:27 am
I think part of it is worldview, and part of it is age. I can remember when hospitals offered free service to those who couldn’t afford it — and, of course, before the litigation and insurance explosions, most people could afford it.
As for what I was saying Americans would balk at — what I balk at — is having to pay (because nothing is free — “free” healthcare just means more taxes) for healthcare that is, on the whole, a lot worse than what is now available — and vastly worse than what used to be available. I have a British friend who was a policewoman injured in the line of duty, and it still took her two weeks to get in to see a doctor, and almost two years to get the surgery the injury had made necessary. Due to the delay, her injury didn’t heal properly, and she was told she needed to find a new job. And Canada — I don’t know anyone in Canada who wouldn’t trade their healthcare system for ours.
However, I suspect that we will continue to come to different conclusions because we have been presented with different evidence. But it has been interesting exploring a different viewpoint.
And thanks so much for the info on Tokyo. I was already excited about my return trip, but now I’m even more eager to get back.
waltzingaustralia said,
September 25, 2008 at 3:36 pm
I was just going over your notes and noticed the rec for Enoshiima Island. I was there on my last (first) trip to Japan, and I agree, it’s a real delight (and it also suggests that the other recommendations will suit me). I’ve been trying to figure out how to fit everything in. I’ll probably only have 3 or 4 days in Tokyo, 4 days in Shizuoka (visiting a friend), and for days in Kyoto. With one day on each end just for traveling, suddenly, the two weeks is gone. (Sigh.) I guess there is never enough time to see everything. But I am looking forward to following a few of your tips when I get to Tokyo.
Again, thanks.